Madonna & Child Mantle Clock | ||
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Posted 10 years ago
rhauser8
(1 item)
The clock measures: 15 1/4" high, 17 1/4" wide, and 5 1/4" deep
Very heavy cast material, non-magnetic.
Markings on the movement: Seth Thomas New York, R. Kaiser, 45481, ST Logo
Can anyone help identify the maker, age, and possible value of this piece?
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http://m.ebay.co.uk/itm?itemId=191241715311
http://www.liveauctioneers.com/item/10126995
I would try to remove this awful paint...
Just confirming what has already been stated, you have a Seth Thomas & Sons Mantel Clock case. The model was marketed as their "No. 8015" from circa 1872. While Seth Thomas & Sons did manufacture clocks with Cartouche Numbered Dials, this dial looks a little different than what I would expect. Also, the hands don't look original to the clock as they are not the usual style seen with these clocks and they also look too big for the face...particularly the hour hand. Seth Thomas proudly traded on their good name and so they were not shy about "branding" their clocks and movements. If your clock's movement is not stamped with the name Seth Thomas and Sons somewhere on the front or back plate I would be suspicious as to whether or not it is original to the clock. Zinc alloy, Spelter or White Metal should be considered as fragile. It looks like your clock's Statues and Decorative elements are all there. If it was painted to cover up repairs, that would adversely affect its value to a collector. If it were just painted, that could be easily remedied with judicious striping of the gold paint. If you could show us a well lighted close up of the movement (unscrew the bell...it's easy to remove and replace) we might be able to give you some more information.
Hope that helps solve your mystery. Thanks for sharing your clock with us.
I took detailed pictures of the movement. It is clearly marked with the Seth Thomas logo and has the number 45481 at the bottom. The name "R. Kaiser" is also visible. If I can figure out how to attach these three new photos, I'll post them. Thanks for all your comments.
Okay, I took out two of the pictures and put in the three detailed ones. Mr. Morris commented that the clock was painted. Anyone know what the original finish was?
natural whitish metal, no paint
The premium 15-day round R. Kaiser Time & Strike Movements were only found in some of Seth Thomas' more expensive mantel clocks. The "45481" is this movement's serial number. Although these metal cases were often made of Spelter (also known as Zinc Alloy, White Metal or Pot Metal) they were usually given a bronze-like finish of some type. Although Spelter was easier to work with and significantly cheaper to finish than other cast metals, antique examples are very collectible. Even though Spelter is metal, it should be considered as fragile. I treat it like glass. Through time the finish often "wore off" leaving the white metal which Kerry mentions exposed. Subsequently they were often refinished. A professionally applied bronze finish would have been "better" than gold which was very popular at some point in the past. Your finish is not badly done. The paint doesn't appear to be so thick that it obscures detail. If you decide to refinish it, have it done professionally or leave it as is.
As to value, there's currently another example being offered on eBay. You can look that up for your own information and you can search on the model number already given to find other examples through time. It's not rare but it doesn't come up that often, in my experience anyway.
As to "Book Value", a mint all original example in good running order was valued at $900 back in 2005. Generally speaking, antique clock prices have declined since then. Rare models have retained, if not appreciated in value.
I want to thank all the helpful people who responded to my query. Thank you for solving my mystery. Special thanks to Bruce999 for his expertise and willingness to share it. If I do decide to do anything to the piece, I will be sure to have it professionally done. Thank you for your kind advice.