Posted 4 years ago
JavaLava
(1 item)
I inherited this and was told that originally it was a treadle machine but I don't know if that's true.
My grandmother's Singer sewing machine | ||
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My grandmother's Singer sewing machine | ||
| ttomtucker's loves1659 of 12678 | | |
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Posted 4 years ago
JavaLava
(1 item)
I inherited this and was told that originally it was a treadle machine but I don't know if that's true.
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The electric motors were able to replace the treadles without much trouble. I think usually they used the same model but made a new one for the motorized portables.
Thank you fortapache. Do you know of any way of finding that out and also how old this one might be?
Hi, JavaLava. :-)
I don't know whether your machine head was originally installed in a treadle cabinet, but it's possible.
Many models of vintage Singer sewing machines could be easily converted to a portable by adding a hand-crank mechanism. In fact, kits are still available to this day, e.g.:
http://www.sewingmachineparts.net/handcranks.html
That little trapezoidal access panel on the front of your machine head identifies it as belonging to the VS1, VS2, VS3, 27, 28, 127 and 128 family:
https://www.singersewinginfo.co.uk/28
A quick search of Google Images for "singer model 28k hand crank" turned up more than a couple portables with covers like yours.
If you provide a close-up picture of the serial number, e.g.:
https://www.singermachines.co.uk/pub/media/upload/image/model_5.jpg
Then we can find out when that serial number was allotted to the factory that manufactured it. That's about as close as you can get on age. There's a bit of wobble room in that date, because it would take the factory some time to work its way through a block of serial numbers.
For instance, a block of serial numbers might have been allotted in one year, but some individual serial numbers in that block of numbers might not have been produced until the next year.
There was even a more substantial gap between serial number allotment and actual machine production during WWII, because Singer, like many companies, was busy with the war effort:
https://sewalot.com/dating_singer_sewing_machine_by_serial_number.htm
See here starting at the 14:17 mark of this circa 1934 Singer documentary the machine that would stamp serial numbers into the bed plates:
https://movingimage.nls.uk/film/1592
FYI, the decal set on your machine head is called "Victorian":
https://www.singersewinginfo.co.uk/decals/decal08
Wow keramikos, that's wonderful information, a lot to read - thank you so much. I'm away at the moment but will check the serial number and post it here. Thanks again for all your help.
JavaLava, You're very welcome. :-)
You know, in watching part of that Singer documentary again, I noticed that during the sequence in which ornamentation is applied, one of the workers appears to be applying the "Victorian" decal set to a VS1/VS2/VS3/27/28/127/128 family machine, around 17:10 - 17:52.
The chromed pieces haven't been attached yet, so you can't tell the model by the slide plates, but the place where the little 'trapezoidal' access door will be installed is just a hole in the casting, and you can see right through to the worker's apron at times.
More about the VS1, VS2, VS3, 27, 28, 127 and 128 family of machines:
https://www.quiltingroomwithmel.com/2018/02/history-of-singer-27-vintage-sewing.html
JavaLava, Your grandmother's vintage sewing machine seems to be my newest obsession. };-)
The more I looked at it, the more it seemed possible that it was originally installed in a treadle cabinet, and latterly removed from that cabinet, fitted with a hand crank, and installed in a portable case.
What caused me to favor this theory was one detail in your first photograph.
The hand crank has been turned such that the little wooden handle is turned inwards. You couldn't operate it in that position, so it's been turned that way for storage with the case cover installed.
From what I've read around the Internet, a lot of machines converted from treadle to hand crank, and installed in a portable case could no longer have the case cover installed, because the hand crank protruded too far.
It even seems to have worn the finish a bit on the wood of the case base, probably from years of being moved around.
I still can't quite figure out the specific model of your machine, but we should be able to make a final determination on that once you get back to it, add the serial number to your post, and perhaps make a few measurements.
It doesn't look like an early model 27, because it seems like your machine has the raised boss that permits installation of a standard handcrank:
https://www.treadleon.net/sewingmachineshop/motorboss/motorboss.html
https://oldsingersewingmachineblog.com/2012/10/01/how-to-fit-a-handcrank-to-an-early-singer-27k-treadle/
It would seem to fly in the face of logic that it would be a model 28, because the main difference between that and a model 27 is size. The model 28 is a three-quarters size version of the 27, so it really was designed for portability.
Nevertheless, some model 28 machines were indeed originally installed in treadle cabinets. The Wikipedia article on the VS1/VS2/VS3/27/28/127/128 family of Singer machines actually has a wealth of detail about the various sub-models:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Singer_Model_27_and_127
A modern handyman is in fact making new portable case bases for vintage sewing machines (sans accessories compartments), and he's my new hero for providing dimensions, especially those center to center hinge ones:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/BASE-WOOD-FOR-SINGER-OTHER-BRAND-SEWING-MACHINES-15-CLASS-66-201-99-185-other-/392608744495
Some people might think that this is a lot of trouble for old sewing machines, but it isn't just antique lovers and apocalypse preppers who like old, portable, non-electric, sewing machines.
I recently watched part of a 2005 movie about a family of Mongolian nomads, and the mother/wife of the family is seen using a hand crank sewing machine starting at around the 31:05 mark:
Sar? Köpe?in Yuvas? - The Cave of the Yellow Dog
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFP-v2uoBQ4
I couldn't quite tell the make and model, but it had a solid balance wheel, a D-shaped needle plate, and a black finish with gold decals. Perhaps I need to go back, and watch the rest of the movie, because at one point, the family moves, and has to pack up all their worldly belongings, including the sewing machine.
A'ight. Forget what I said about the hand crank being turned inwards as a clue that your grandmother's machine might have been converted from a treadle.
I don't own a hand-crank Singer, indeed I don't own a vintage sewing machine at all, unless you want to count my 1980s vintage portable, so I had to go out there on the Internet again in an attempt to understand how that hand crank mechanism functions.
I found some good pictures and text. Here is a blogger who converted a Singer using a reproduction hand crank. They do a good job of explaining the part of the mechanism that secures the hand crank for operation:
*snip*
There's a little pin you can pull out on the hand crank to secure the handle. The handle is movable so that you can fit your case over it. Some cases won't fit over the machine unless you move the handle.
*snip*
https://mermaidsden.com/blog/2016/06/23/vintage-singer-99k-sewing-machine-converting-to-a-hand-crank
So that's probably why the hand crank on your grandmother's machine looked a bit odd to me: it isn't secured for operation, but rather is in the position to permit installation of the cover for storage.
Here is a persistent listing of a 1901 vintage hand crank Singer 28K (I looked up serial number P863995, and it is indeed from 1901 and a model 28K) which has a good side view picture of the original hand crank, plus the mahogany 'coffin top' cover:
https://en.todocoleccion.net/antiques-technical/maquina-coser-singer-28k-diseno-victorian-funciona-cose-ano-julio-1901~x135575650
And here is a Pinterest listing for a portable Singer described as being of 1902 vintage that I'm including simply because the base of the portable case looks similar to yours in that it doesn't seem to have the accessory compartment on the balance wheel side (although it does have a deep machined groove):
https://www.pinterest.com/pin/570831321499996715/
So that accessories compartment might have been an evolutionary feature that didn't exist on early portable cases.
Ultimately, the only way that you might be able to tell whether your grandmother's machine had been converted from treadle to hand crank portable would be to examine the machine and case closely.
That is to say, examine it for scratches or the presence/absence of lacquer around the hinges and hand crank that might suggest somebody had tinkered with it. Yes. I know. Barrels of fun. >8-0
JavaLava, I think I may have missed a fairly obvious clue as to whether your grandmother's sewing machine had been converted from installation in a treadle cabinet to a portable: the "coffin top" case cover doesn't appear to have handles.
I suppose it could have been another evolutionary change, but to me, it doesn't make a great deal of sense for a portable case not to have any handle(s).
Here is a drawing of Extension Leaf Table No 87 (a treadle) with its optional coffin top cover sitting beside it:
http://ismacs.net/singer_sewing_machine_company/extlf_cab.html
There are no handles on the cover, but this is a treadle cabinet, so the only thing the user would be lifting would be the wooden cover itself.
If it were a portable then the user would be lifting the cover, the base, and the cast iron sewing machine head.
A Singer model 27 head apparently weighs 27 pounds.
Even the three-quarters sized model 28 installed in a mahogany coffin top portable case weighs almost 30 pounds:
*snip*
I decided I would weigh my 1891 Model # 28 in its mahogany coffin case. Fully dressed and ready to carry it weighs 29.5 pounds.
*snip*
https://www.quiltingroomwithmel.com/2018/02/history-of-singer-27-vintage-sewing.html
So it would make sense to have handles on the case like this:
(From sewcranky dot com, a Singer model 27 installed in a portable case with a handled 'coffin top' lid.)
https://images.app.goo.gl/6TexrwVsucGTmGRk9
Here is another:
http://www.helenporemba.uk/blog/2016/4/7/they-dont-make-them-like-they-used-to-2
Here's another (it isn't quite the same style, but there are multiple pictures from all angles, which are priceless in my book):
http://ancientpoint.com/inf/113034-antique_victorian_coffin_top_1903_singer_28_k_hand_crank_sewing_machine_128_27.html
So, I suspect that your grandmother's machine may have indeed originally been installed in a treadle cabinet.
In order to make your grandmother's sewing machine operational outside of a treadle cabinet, it would have needed installation of either a motor or a hand crank. A portable case for storage when it wasn't being used would have been nice as well.
I don't know where the tray portion of the portable case came from, but the coffin top cover might well have been the same one used on a treadle cabinet, and hence not have had handles.
The whole thing probably weighs close to 30 pounds or even more, but most people back in the early part of the 20th century weren't weak. };-)
Hi keramikos
I'm so sorry but the cover does have handles, apologies that the original photo didn't show them. Here's another photo and also one with the serial number.
Edited to add: I don't know what's happened but there doesn't seem to be a way to upload more photos so I can't show you the cover with the handles. The serial number is 12761972. The number is quite worn but I'm pretty certain that that's the correct one.
Hi JavaLava. Welcome back. :-)
So the cover does have handles. OK, throw out that theory.
Per Singer/ISMACS records, serial number 12761972 was allotted in 1895:
*snip*
12,475,500 13,387,999 1895
*snip*
http://ismacs.net/singer_sewing_machine_company/serial-numbers/singer-no-prefix-serial-numbers.html
Because there is no model information to be gleaned from the serial number tables for non-alpha prefix serial numbers, we have to rely on the physical characteristics of the machine head itself.
We already know that it belongs to the VS1, VS2, VS3, 27, 28, 127 and 128 family (because of the trapezoidal access panel, and the split slide plates), and being that it was manufactured no earlier than 1895, we can probably rule out the VS1, VS2, and VS3. I think we can also rule out the 127 and 128 (no high-mounted bobbin winder), so that just leaves the 27 and 28.
All that remains is to take a few key measurements to rule out one or the other. I'll put the link for the measurements in this comment so that you don't have to comb back through all the verbiage:
https://www.singersewinginfo.co.uk/28
As to pictures: you're allowed up to four pictures per post, so you can add two more to this one. You edit your post to add, subtract, or change pictures.
If that seems too difficult or limiting, you can create a whole new post, and then link the two posts in the comment sections (I'll do the latter part for you if you so desire).
I think we're back to my suggestion about examining the case and the hardware (especially the area around the hinges) for scratches and/or missing finish as a way of figuring out whether it had been taken out of a treadle cabinet to make it portable.
Congratulations, JavaLava. I see that you were able to edit your post and add two more pictures. :-)
The closeup of the serial number is upside down, but that's a minor issue, probably caused by the Collectors Weekly Show & Tell interface software.
It has a tendency not to play well with all photograph sources, especially smartphones and tablets.
The usual workaround is to advise the user to save the photograph on a desktop or laptop machine and then add that version, but not everybody has one of those nowadays. I wouldn't worry about it, because the serial number is read easily enough as is.
Probably the easiest measurement to make is either the bed width or bed depth.
If if the bed width is 14 and 5/8 inches, or the bed depth is 7 inches, it's a model 27.
If the bed width is 12 and 5/32 inches, or the bed depth is 6 and 9/16 inches, it's a model 28.
Sorry, I realize that Imperial weights and measures are miserable enough without fractions, so:
MODEL 27 BED WIDTH: 37.1475cm
MODEL 27 BED DEPTH: 17.78cm
MODEL 28 BED WIDTH: 30.876875cm
MODEL 28 BED DEPTH: 16.66875cm
https://www.rapidtables.com/convert/length/cm-to-inch.html
Feel free to double check my work; I have good math days and bad math days. >8-0
Hi again, JavaLava. :-)
Here's hoping that you're well, and perhaps just too busy to do any more work on this post.
There might be one more place to examine for signs of conversion from a treadle to a hand crank, and that would be the presence of a belt pulley.
See this CW S&T post for a picture of a treadle-mounted Singer model 27 with the belt pulley partially exposed because no belt is installed (just to the left of the balance wheel, and underneath the decal-decorated pulley guard:
https://www.collectorsweekly.com/stories/14929-vintage-1900-model-27-singer-sewing-mach
I've looked at more than a few 27/28 hand cranks online, and while they all seem to have something that looks like a pulley guard, it's not clear to me that they have a grooved pulley underneath that would accommodate a belt. A machine that was a hand crank right from the get go wouldn't need one.
Ultimately, perhaps the best evidence that your grandmother's machine was converted is the story handed down in your family that it was converted. :-)
Sigh. Singer model 28 hand crank sans pulley guard:
https://www.catawiki.com/l/8081603-singer-model-28-hand-sewing-machine-1908
I supposed it's possible that a sewing machine pulley that spend much time in actual operation with a leather belt rubbing it might be shinier than one that didn't.
Thank you keramikos for all the information. I'm not ignoring you but I've had some bad news about the health of a close family member this week and all other thoughts have flown out of my mind. I am interested in everything you've told me but my head is not in a good place just at the moment. I'm hoping that early next week, I'll be able to sit quietly, concentrate, re-read and get the sewing machine out again so I can measure then post dimensions. Apologies again and thank you for all your help.
Hi JavaLava.
I'm so sorry to read that you're having family health issues. :-(
In the big scheme of things, the provenance of an old sewing machine doesn't count for much.
Take care of yourself and your family.