Posted 4 years ago
bohemiangl…
(647 items)
This is a very small Loetz cabinet vase rich in history - an original "Made in Austria" paper label, hand numbered No. 61(3 or 5?) in Heliotrop ground. There is an incomplete DEK marking underneath the paper label, which I was able to illuminate an impression of through an experimental process of black light, iPhone camera at high magnification, a steady hand, and some post production magic. I definitely looks like DEK I/1?4 - the middle number appears to be missing or incomplete, but it does very much look like the documented examples of DEK I/184 shown on Loetz.com. Feel free to tell me what you see; no labels were harmed or altered in the production of these images. :)
About 4" tall.
Amazing the label survived so long!
Great piece. I bet it could tell a story, if it could talk.
Interesting premise except for one thing, the Made In Austria label would have been later than 1920, I expect it represents the post WWI Republic of Austria, made for export to USA.
Possible its a piece that was not sent but made before that, I find the quality is not as good as the usual early Loetz glass gold decorated pieces.
how could this been made in 1920 when the dek/184 is around 1898, and what is wrong about the quality , there is nothing wrong with the quality, so it is stashed for 20years ?
apostata, sometimes the knowledge of historical facts are important in the evaluation of certain items and their labels.
If you translated all of what Warren stated, it is his experienced opinion that he discusses here not a fact, and is quite willing to hear other's opinions.
Why you always focus on me on any posts is a mystery, no matter what your negative reaction is about.
no i dont focus on you, i only was surprised why you did not knew your own stock, see meiji and your quianlong cloisonne
well there is nothing with my historical knowledge
and you did as usual did not answered the question, substantiate the quality and the time inconsistency, AKA as answering a question
you may use a databank for the KNOWLEDGE OF HISTORICAL FACTS
cloisonne has nothing to do with this post, you digress.
According to the English language label, Made In Austria, which was a wording requirement for imports to USA, by Tarif Law in 1921, not before, that is the reason for my comment and opinion. The rest is conjecture.
The Made in Austria concept dates much earlier than some think. It was a British requirement for foreign goods imported from 1887.
I am severely impressed with the photos provided of the marks underneath this label. Congratulations !!! Real Sleuthing !!!
i always wonder why people are doing busuiness without knowing the legislation vertraio 50 ty you stated the obvious , it doesn,t help TOD because she never will give in
dear vetraio you always UV your stock , its standard procedure
With regard to the paper label, let me say a few things:
1. Because the "Made in" labels were required starting in 1930 does not preclude their use beforehand. In fact, The McKinley Tariff Act of 1890 required that "all articles of foreign manufacture, such as are usually or ordinarily marked..., and all packages containing such or other imported articles, shall, respectively, be plainly marked, stamped, branded, or labeled in legible English words, so as to indicate the country of their origin; and unless so marked, stamped, branded, or labeled they shall not be admitted entry." Nearly identical provisions were included in Tariff acts of 1894, 1897, 1909, and 1913.
2. The use of a paper label would be in violation of the 1930 requirement that the marking be "permanent" (i.e. engraved, stamped, or painted). Although Loetz used paper labels after 1920, none of those were to indicate country of origin - coo marks were always either acid stamped or painted, and none of them said Austria, because...
3. The Loetz factory was not located in Austria in the 1920s and beyond - the area was part of Czechoslovakia beginning in 1918, and all Loetz articles after this time reflect Czechoslovakia or Czecho-Slovakia, when country of origin is designated.
4. A paper label of this type was affixed to a vase in this same decor and color (different shape) that indicated that the piece was exhibited at the 1893 Columbian Exposition in Chicago. (See Kai Hasselbach's article about Early Loetz Production on Loetz.com, figure 47.03)
https://www.loetz.com/identifying-loetz-glass/early-loetz
So I guess what I am saying is, trust me on this one. The piece and its label are good, and date to the 1890s.
See Loetz.com for additional information about markings on Loetz glass both before and after 1918.
Thank you Warren, the link was very impressive and shows much added information since I last read it.
Thank you all for commenting :)
Love all the debate on this lovely vase, so much to learn..thank you ..smiling
what happened to moonstone lover 21? She has not posted for many years. I hope she is fine. Thanks for info.
Paper labels can be misleading, unlike marks on porcelain.
This observation supports authenticity and dating of Made in Austria label:
Porcelain factory in Elbogen (Loket), Bohemia, exported to USA with the following mark in purple: ``CARLSBAD CHINA, BFHS, Made in Austria``.
The mark was used between 1897 and 1901 on items made for Benjamin F. Hunt & Sons in Boston.
Thank you Ivan or paper label versus marks on porcelain. However, my question was what happened to moonstone lover21? I hope she is fine since I have not seen. her post for the past 5 years. Tried to find out but do not. know her last name. First name is Lee. Any info is highly appreciated.
ccj, moonstonelover21 (Lee Miller, if that is indeed her real name) quit collecting a few years ago (before the pandemic), and she absconded with almost $300 that I paid her for a piece that she never delivered or refunded, despite promises over several months to do so. I broke off contact at that point, and never heard from her since. I will be happy if our paths never cross again.
Because I am in the comments section, I was able to see all the messages again, and realized that I find a couple of discreptancies.
My objection was not that this vase was not produced by Loetzm but that the label was a later one. I have stated this before, the USA tarif law for import of decorative items had one small change in the wording, that was adding 'Made IN'. This does not mean the 2 words were not used before on imports, but that it was a new legal requirement after 1921. The UK market's imports were not marked at all, I don't see how Harrach could compete with the British glass houses Art Nouveau designs, if they were marked. Perhaps the contract with International distributors changed this category's status.
Austria was part of the Austro Hungarian Empire for several centuries. After WWII, Loetz provided several permanent signature marks on their glass after 1920, and the words used are Loetz Austria. Makes sense to me. The paper label maybe older, and/or an addition, hard to say after this much time.
TOD says "After WWII, Loetz provided several permanent signature marks on their glass after 1920, and the words used are Loetz Austria."
Post 1918, Loetz was located in Czechoslovakia, and not Austria. They most certainly would not have used "Loetz Austria" at the time. Nor would they have applied a label stating Austria at all. "Loetz Austria" was an engraved signature, and the use of that mark stopped very early in the 1900's. The end date of it's use is considered to be around 1903.
TOD says "Austria was part of the Austro Hungarian Empire for several centuries."
The "Austrian Empire" began in 1814. The Austro-Hungarian Empire was forged in 1867, and lasted until 1918. The Dual Monarchy Empire lasted only 51 years, and not centuries.